What would you do?
One of the toughest things about putting out a newspaper is deciding where to put stories. In many ways, it’s a guessing game. I’ve played that game many times and struggled with the decisions. It’s not easy on many days.
I mention that because of this story that appeared across the top of my sports page this morning. Yes, this is “Soccer City” — I’m not sure why, but that’s what they call it. So perhaps that’s why the University of Portland’s win over No. 1-ranked USC is deemed the very best, most interesting story in sports Tuesday morning.
Even though only 3,280 people attended the game. I mean, the Portland Beavers draw more fans than that almost every night of the season but can’t ever get their stories anywhere near the cover of the sports section — let alone across the top. And yes, I realize that’s still quite a crowd for a women’s college soccer game. Perhaps many tens of thousands more than 3,280 care about the game but just couldn’t get a ticket?
How do we measure interest in sporting events if not by the attendance? And should fan interest in an event play any role in how it is displayed in the paper? When you put stories like this one in such a prominent place, are you becoming an advocate for this event? Are you telling people, “You probably don’t care about this — but you should!” Or are you merely classifying this game as the biggest news you have on Tuesday morning? Is this just a product of the fact that there are some pretty slow news days around here in the sports section this time of year?
What do you think?
Media, Soccer | Dwight Jaynes | September 2, 2008
Dwight Jaynes, Soccer City, Sports pages, University of Portland women's soccer
It is a legitimate story even if you don’t like the sport and even if the Blazers draw more fans for an open practice. A local team knocked off the number one team in the country. If it happened with PSU basketball, which draws 1,000 per game, you can bet that it would be above-the-fold news too. The beautiful thing is that if you don’t care about the story you don’t have to read it. In fact, there were many a day when I skipped over your columns, Dwight.
Dwight,
I know you have never been interested in women’s sports.
One thing you might consider is the level of excelence involved. UP hasn’t done worse than the quarterfinals in this millenium, and that includes two National Championships. Has OSU done anything as good even once?
I hate to be the guy to defend OSU, but they did win back-to-back national championships in baseball. Sorry Larry, that trumps anything UP soccer has done this millennium.
C-Ho,
Correct me if I am wrong, but I don’t believe the Beavers have made it to the quarterfinals every year in this millennium. Congrats on the back to back wins, but in my biased opinion the Pilot women win this one!
Fellas! Let me ask you one thing: does the fact that this is a very minor sport at most NCAA institutions matter at all? If Oregon wins the women’s field hockey title this season, is it front-page, banner-headline treatment? That’s part of the issue here … what is the interest level in women’s soccer — even at the championship level? I’d submit that when you’re playing the No. 1-ranked team in the country and can draw only 3,280 people, the interest level isn’t all that high, whether you are a perennial powerhouse or not.
Dwight,
While 3200+ is not a high draw for most college sport programs, it is a large number for women’s soccer (UP leads the nation in average attendance). I understand you shaking your head, but the Oregonian is based in Portland and there happens to be interest in the UP program in this city. It may or may not deserve a front page spot, but in reality it is not that much of a shocker.
Like I said, Dwight, you are a dinosaur who has no interest in women’s sports, so of course there is no interest on your part in UP soccer. Since you don’t help promote the sport, It’s hard to see how you can criticize attendance.
The real question is why you entrenched sports dinosaurs reported on the Blazers all those years they were nothing but thugs and drug addicts who liked to abuse dogs? My guess is that is was easier to write about and you were lazy you were spoon fed stories by a well financed team media organization, and you grew up with football, baseball, and basketball.
You have never taken the time to understand the sport of soccer, so rather than show your ignorance, you just ignore the sport and then cite attendance as the reason. If you had helped promote and report on the sport in the first place, attendance would be higher. As it happens, the attendance is more than double student undergrad enrollment, Beavers baseball can’t claim that.
And just for the record- baseball even in the USA , especially in the NCAA, is a minor sport. fewer participants, fewer schools play it, and there is less funding ( fewer scholarships offered).
C-Ho–
The fact is, that the UP women’s team is the best team in the state by any measure in this millenium and the last decade of the last one. More total wins, better winning percentage, more tournament appearances, higher finish each year, more conference championships – the works.
Just for comparison, I’ll list the finishes each year since 1992, their first year in the tournament
1992 first round
1993 quarterfinals
1994 semifinals
1995 final
1996 semifinals
1997 first round
1998 semifinals
1999 no bid (the only year)
2000 semifinals
2001 semifinals
2002 National champions
2003 sweet 16
2004 quarterfinals
2005 National championships
2006 quarterfinals
2007 quarterfinals
nine of those years were also conference championships.
The beavers don’t match that even considering the smaller tournament field.
You guys are full of hype and no finish. The whole year you talked threepeat and then didn’t even get in the tournament.
When you are in the tournament for 15 years or so, we can have this discussion again.
PS-
While the Portland Beavers may have a larger attendance, I’m not so sure that a majority of those attending are really into the Beavers. Great place to take your kids, grab a dog and relax. People attending the Pilots games are for the most part devoted fans.
Portland is “Soccer City?” None of the crowds I’ve seen at soccer matches have been extraordinary, with the exception of the Women’s World Cup, which was supported BOTH Nike and adidas with many employees and their families in attendance!
The Timbers draw a fairly decent crowd, but it’s no larger than a typical Winterhawks game. UP draws a decent crowd, but it’s nothing to write home about.
What makes Portland “Soccer City?” Probably the same mentality that thinks an MLB team can survive here.
Asahi, the Timbers average 8,200 per game. The Winterhawks drew less than 4,000 per game last season.
Ed/Larry:
I do have interest in women’s sports. We’re not talking about MY interest, though, we’re talking about the public’s interest. And seriously, you need to know I’ve never been in a job where it was my job to “promote” anyone’s sport. My job was to figure out what people wanted to read about and go there. That’s what this post was all about — trying to figure out the interest level in the game in question. And you’re still not convincing me that all of Portland was agog over this game. And if this really is Soccer City, then why wasn’t it standing room only for this game?
You are reading way too much into the oregonian printing this story front page. People like the lady’s program at UP and I bet that most people in this state enjoy seeing the university of spoiled children get beat. David and Goliath, ever heard of that story Dwight?
But who is the Goliath here? Do you think anyone at USC outside of the players cares much about the women’s soccer program? That’s the big edge they have at UP — the women’s soccer program is the centerpiece for the entire athletic department. John — they don’t have football at UP. There is NO university in the country that takes better care of its women soccer players than Portland. That’s why it recruits as well as it does. That’s great — I’m not against that. But don’t paint this as a small-time program beating a big-time program. That’s simply not the case.
It sure is about beating a big program. Both OSU and U of O alumni and fans hate USC. USC has the rich past and current streak of greatness. We all want that for our respective universities. Since UP is not in the same league as OSU and U of O, they are not a threat to the alumni and fans of our 2 biggest schools in Oregon. All college fans from the state of Oregon love to see ‘the big boys’ get beat. Especially by their little sister.
Dwight-
Sometimes a sporting event carries enough import whether 50,000 drunken fans see it or not. Wilt Chamberlain scored his 100 points in Hershey PA in front of about the same number of fans that see a UP women’s soccer game. Hershey recorded 4000+ . UP Women’s soccer so far this year has averaged 4245 per game. By your standard, Wilt’s feat wasn’t worth reporting, was it?
That figure was about average for NBA games back then, I recall- maybe a little above average. The game was played in Hershey because they could get a bigger gate there than in Philly.
On Saturday, the UCLA -Portland game was sold out. – over capacity, really. the stadium had about 225 people who had to stand. That’s going against the team in the state that has the most money, sponsorship, media hype, parking lot drunkeness, and TV coverage of all. At least some people wanted to see it. (I’m one. I turned down tickets to the Duck game).
Yeah, Monday’s 2:30 game was a bit down from that average, but classes were in session, and the kids are trying to get an education. The game couldn’t be later in order to get the UCLA kids back home so they wouldn’t have to spend another school night here.
Plus, it was the sixth game in 4 days of soccer at UP. About 12,000-13,000 tickets were sold for soccer at UP this weekend. right now, the school is leading the nation in attendance for games, and it’s probably stadium size that is the biggest impediment to increased gate. attendance has gone up about 10% per year for the last several years, leading the Nation all the while. It has an incredibly loyal fan base, and the competition is the best in Women’s sports.
You are missing the (house)boat on this one, Dwight. You’ve never actually been to a game, have you? I don’t mean eating Nachos in the hospitality suite, I mean really getting in the stands and watching?
You must have missed the inference in the first sentence of my post Larry, so I’ll restate it more clearly: I hate the Beavers, so save the “you guys” for someone else.
Consider.
1) I hate the Beavers
2) I hate baseball
3) I like soccer and
4) I live a mile from UP
So wouldn’t you think I’d be the exact kind of person who’d consider the accomplishments of the UP women’s soccer team greater than those of the OSU baseball team? I’d like to, but I don’t. I don’t think many average Oregon sports fans would disagree.
You obviously have a horse in this race. I don’t. Edge goes to OSU.
C-Ho-
Thanks for the opinion from the French Judge.
But in my book, 2 championships and 15 tournament appearances trumps 2 championships in 16 years and 3 tournament appearances every time.
I like Pat Casey, He’s a UP grad, but the performance of that team last year almost drove him to retirement, or did you forget?
Why don’t you ask him?
Ed,
Almost half of the Timbers home games (9 of 20) fall on Thursdays – “Cheap Beer Night” at PGE Park. Add in a warm, sunny summer day and this certainly inflates attendance levels and draws people who aren’t true Timbers fans to the stadium.
As for the Winterhawks, when they were good, the attendance levels were much higher. In fact, they have historically been one of the best franchises in the CHL. Considering they play during the Winter and don’t benefit from sunny weather and alcohol promotions, I’d say that their fanbase is more true to the sport than Timber fans.
How many times have The Oregonian and Portland Tribune led with a high school sports story? How many people attend high school games in Portland? Most of the time it is less than 3,200.