Is Nate throwing his players under the bus?
That’s what it reads like in this story. He’s basically saying, with great help from the writer, that his team isn’t playing good defense because the players aren’t good defenders. Sort of a “it’s not my fault” kind of stance.
“Can they get better? Will they become a defender? Will they become a stopper? Is that what you are saying?”
What I am saying, is that I don’t see many defensive players on this roster.
“So what do you do?” McMillan asked rhetorically.
But if you read all the way to the end, you’ll see that Kevin Pritchard isn’t buying one bit of it. To me, the real story behind this story is the difference of opinion between Portland’s coach and its general manager:
“It’s about a lot more than individuals,” Pritchard said. “Defense isn’t one person, it’s a team. I think the question is can we as a team be good defenders? I’ve been on teams where you go down the roster and say, ‘Nope, we’re not going to be a good defensive team.’ But we ended up being good. The onus isn’t on 1 or 2 players, it’s on all of us.”
I’m with Pritchard on this one. I’ve seen too many good defensive teams in the NBA that didn’t feature marquee defensive players. It’s as much a system thing as anything. You have to have a plan and stick to it.
Coaches, NBA, Trail Blazers | Dwight Jaynes | February 9, 2009
Dwight Jaynes, Kevin Pritchard, Nate McMillan, Portland Trail Blazers
I agree – it’s certainly a system.
Although I don’t think some of the guys on the team are without defensive skills. Even though I wouldn’t put Travis on the list of good defenders, I’ve seen glimmers of solid D from him.
Quick also calls out Oden, but I’m not sure anyone expected him to be a great defender out of the gates; esp. after a surgery that will hinder your quickness. It doesn’t help when team strategies revolve around getting him to foul. I think, in time, Oden will be fine. We know that he can contest a shot. He certainly has a good teacher in Pryzbilla.
The talk that this team is not built to play defense is a load of BS. Pritchard is 100 % right. It doesn’t matter if your team isn’t stacked with defenders to be at least a solid defensive club.
Portland has more than enough athletic, hard working, intelligent players to be at least a decent defensive team at this point. All it takes for a team with those traits is a solid scheme to make it work.
Look at Boston and their rotation. How many “defenders” do they have? Allen was an atrocious defender in Seattle (where he played under Nate, coincidentally), Pierce was equally bad for most of his career too, plus their bench is filled with average to below average defenders. The thing that makes them the best in the league is a great defensive scheme and a few great individual defenders like Garnett and Rondo to make the rest follow. Just look at Eddie House and how hard he busts his ass on defense now. Same with Pierce and Allen.
No one is expecting Portland to be a be a great defensive team right away, but there’s still no excuse to be as horrendous as they’ve been so far.
It seems there are 2 camps of Blazer fans out there. The “Fire Nate” group and the “Nate will lead us to a championship” group. Dwight, you seem to belong to the latter group.
You use the word “system” more than KP uses the word “culture”. The difference is that we are all very clear on what KP means when he uses the word culture as it applies to this team. Your use of the word system isn’t all that clear to me.
I do not think that Nate’s system allows Travis to look confused and lost on the defensive end of the court. I do not think that the system calls for Sergio to get beaten by nearly every PG in the league. I do not think that Nate’s system tells the team to switch on every pick and roll, leaving Greg to guard a guard at the top of the key.
You are so quick to dismiss the youth of this team and blame it all on Nate’s system, yet I haven’t seen a clear explanation of what you believe the system to be. Did I miss it in a previous thread? If not, then please explain it before you continue to throw Nate under the bus, which is what I am sure you intended to do with this post.
Whoa… come on Kilntym… If Travis looks confused, isn’t that a coaching problem? If it’s not, then he shouldn’t play. If Sergio can’t defend a point guard and you still need to play him, then who is in charge of covering for him? I seldom see any help arrive for anyone. YOU try to play the point in the NBA these days without being able to hand check. What people are missing is that very, very, very few point guards can stay in front of the other point guards one on one. Rondo, maybe… not many more. So you have a system where players learn to cover for each other… the way other teams do to Portland!! There are some teams in this league — Boston, Orlando, Cleveland, the Lakers, Dallas, Houston, San Antonio come to mind right away — who simply won’t let you play one on one against them. They get help to their defenders. Did you ever see a Jeff Van Gundy team play? That’s what we’re talking about here. I’m not throwing anybody under a bus, just asking questions that need to be asked.
– Dwight
it’s not nate’s fault that travis has a low basketball IQ and looks confused half the time. however…it IS nate’s fault for playing travis 30 minutes a game when he looks confused half the time.
And a PS … don’t you think that KP is saying basically the same thing I’m saying?
– Dwight
Got it, Dwight, but I still disagree to a point. While many people will argue the Youth vs. System debate, I still lean heavily towards the youth side of that argument.
All of the teams you mentioned above have veterans who understand how to play team defense. I just don’t think the Blazers are there yet. If you really want to prove your point, show me a team anywhere close to being as young as Portland who plays defense like the teams you mentioned above.
I refuse to believe that Nate and the coaching staff have a system that would allow the Blazers to play this kind of defense. Maybe it’s wishful thinking on my part, but I have to give them the benefit of the doubt for now.
Why all the love for JVG? His Houston teams were knocked out in the 1st round. If that is the yardstick by which the Blazers are measured, I would say that they are doing just fine.
Yeah, well, I guess JVG’s record is nothing compared to Nate’s… I’m not looking for the Trail Blazers to be the best defensive team in the league… with their offense, they don’t have to be. What you’d like to see is that they’re improving, which they aren’t. It’s possible they’re getting worse. JVG? I’m not advocating he come here or anything like that. Don’t really care, one way or another. But I’d say this — give him TWO WEEKS here and the team defense would improve markedly. And again, I use that as an illustration of how a system can impact a team’s defense… not a reason for hiring JVG.
– Dwight
kilntym:
You can attempt to use the youth factor as many Nate fans/supporters do.
It’s nothing more than an excuse. Again, does a first year almost 100% freshmen team in College make the same mistakes we are? For that matter, do high school teams?
Youth is not an issue in standard defensive schemes. Portland playing through the clutch and learning how to win, that will be a youth factor. Portland getting shook by the Celtics, that’s youth factor. Missing free throws by groups of players in a row, that’s youth factor.
If the team is not executing, you pull the player that is not executing. If none of them are executing, they have tuned out their coach.
Either way, both point at the coach.
How do you explain the Seattle and Team USA teams playing switches on defense? I am sure Nate had an excuse for those two teams also?
I will give them until the end of the month to see if they can improve. They will get a little rest with the All Star break, and their next 5 games are definitely not against any top tier teams. Then on to face Houston and SA, 2 teams that you, Dwight, have singled out as defensive-minded teams.
That should give the coaches and the players enough time to really analyze what is going on. After that, if there is no improvement whatsoever, then I will gladly accept your “system” argument as gospel.
Go Blazers!
It is a system problem. I have a very hard time believing anything else. If it were the players not following instructions, do you think Nate would stand for that? Sarge? Who will yank a player out of the lineup at the first bad pass? No. If the players weren’t following instructions repeatedly, he’d pull guys out of the lineup. But he’s not, is he?
Was the Nate McMillan coached US team instructed to fight through the screens? And they just didn’t follow instructions either? Or maybe they too just didn’t have very good defensive players.
Again, does a first year almost 100% freshmen team in College make the same mistakes we are?
I take it you haven’t watched the Ducks play this season.
A first-year 100% frehsman team in college–isn’t trying to guard NBA players.
There are three reasons players play bad defense: lack of desire (D is unglamorous and hard work), lack of skill (some players lack the mental acuity or physical skills to stop the ball or rotate effectively), and lack of experience.
Most, if not all, of the lack of desire players have been gotten rid of–Zach, Telfair, Miles, Dixon, Magloire.
Several players on the team suffer from lack of skill–Sergio is too small to effectively guard anyone (and lacks quickness to make it up); Blake is too slow to contain most PGs; Travis is too slow to react. Brandon can get overpowered by larger guards.
MANY of the players suffer from lack of experience–including the two guys on the perimeter best suited to play D, Batum and Bayless.
Is this team capable of playing good D? Probably, with a few tweaks. Do they do so right now? No. Is that insufficient experience, or bad coaching? THAT, is the million dollar question.
We’ll find out; it probably won’t be this season.
I am a huge ACC basketball fan. Some of the best ball in the country is played in that conference. Look at V Tech, as well as the more well know Duke and UNC. Look at the defense they play. As far as not playing against NBA players, where do they come from? Chris Paul is ACC. They are system teams and nobody gets consistent clear looks. You want a defensive system bring in Mr. defense, John Chaney.
The team lacks a leader that takes defense as seriously as offense. That player needs to be good enough and respected enough that the other players on the team don’t want to let him down.
Boston has such a player in KG. LeBron has bought in in Cleveland. The next step in B-Roy’s development is to become that player. Either him or LA need to take that next step on the defensive end. The team leaders need to stop excepting the lack of help defense.
I am not saying for one second that Nate doesn’t share blame. I am saying that Nate needs the help of the leaders on the floor to make it happen. In the Olympics he had Kobe. For a brief period in Seattle he had GP. In Portland he currently has no one taking up that torch.
Fun fact about Nate:
In nine years of coaching he has never had a team finish above 17th in defensive rating.
Also Nate has been throwing his players under the bus all season. Does no one recall the first game of the season where he screwed up the gameplan by starting Outlaw instead of Batum because his gut told him to after three weeks of Nic starting? Where he took maybe a smidgen of responsibility for our total annihilation and instead said the players were overwhelmed/confused/in awe etc?
Defense is a team task. We can get better, no doubt. We do, however, have some very poor individual defenders in our lineup. Ever wonder why J.Jack got so many minutes last year?.. because he was one of the only Blazers who fights through screens. The Spanish Turnover connection has his minutes this year and they sure don’t play any D.
ItsMrHarris2u,
You must be watching different games. Rudy is probably one of our best and underrated defenders. Watch him on the defense.
He switches at the right time, covers, etc. Does he have some flaws with the Nate “switching” game plan? Yes!
Look at the Pryzbilla/Rudy scuffle. In all reality, Rudy shouldn’t have had to come down. He was fighting logic with Pryzbilla. With McMillian’s “SYSTEM”, he is supposed to come over. He plays naturally and with maturity. Too bad McMillian doesn’t have a system to match that.
Watch him closely on defense (solely). Just watch, I believe you will agree.
Those picking on Sergio as of late….. it’s amazing if Jason Quick says his opinion on something and all of a sudden it’s gospel and everywhere.
Sergio plays defense NO DIFFERENT than Blake and better than Bayless….Again, maybe you guys need to re-watch games play by play and break it down.. I do.
On Defense…..I think it is all about having a worth ethic. Yes, I think that some guys do get it but I think that some of the guys on the team think the game is all about scoring and not getting back and not going all the way out on the baseline. I think DEFENSE has to be sold to the team.
I think it is a Coaching Staff that has to really sell the idea of playing defense or you sit.
blazermvp,
The play Rudy and Joel you refered to, was Rudy’s fault, it is from the weak side to strong the rotation was supposed to go when Joel rotated over, Rudy was the help. I DO AGREE THOUGH, Rudy is a very good risk taker on defense. I don’t think he is any worse than Brandon. I can’t remember Rudy getting beat back door like Brandon does from time to time. Sergio really is not a good defender, Bayless issue is over aggressive. Sergio has 2 more seasons under his belt plus that international experience you mentioned before. Bayless has much more upside defensively than Sergio.
Dwight,
I love your blog and almost always agree with your opinions. But I think you’re way off base here. I had no idea you were so anti-Nate, which you clearly are by the wording of this post and your comments.
Now, if KP and Nate truly are on opposite ends of the spectrum about this defensive thing, something we have no way of knowing, then obviously something needs to be done. If this is the case, KP is a smart guy and I trust he’ll do what needs to be done. But if, like I suspect, these statements are simply getting misconstrued, then everything will be fine.
Pat B actually makes a much better argument against Nate than anyone else, and it definitely has some bearing. You can’t convince me though, that having Nate as our coach is hurting this team. We are 4th in West at the all-star break (knock on wood). We are ridiculously young. Our rookies have been struggling all year with consistency (like rookies do). And we’re 4th. Home court. Please, get off McMillan’s back. Please.
If Nate really is a poor defensive coach, he certainly makes up for it with his positive attributes. I don’t think there’s very many coaches who would have this team where it’s at right now. Nate has the respect of his players, and knows them from the ground up. This will be very valuable when we’re winning championships in a few years. I’ll be interested to hear from the Nate-haters when he’s racking up coach of the year awards.
Nate not throwing anyone under the bus. I read absolutely no confrontation between KP and Nate; they jsut had a different perspective on saying the same thing. We have a lack of experience on implementing the defensive schemes. Trout is a big offender because he has had the most time to learn Nate’s defense, but has been slow to internalize the defense and move without thinking. Once our players are capable of moving (within the defensive framework) without thinking we will have a good defensive team, yet we won’t have any great defenders with a possible expception for Batum. Rotations (or lack thereof) cause a breakdown but alll of our players are capable of rotating, many just lack the experience to naturally rotate where they need to with pausing first to think. This complication would still be evident even if JVG were coaching as it is a problem of having many young players playing simultaneously. Larry Brown’s oslution would be to get rid of the young guys and get guys who already understand (have internalized) basic defense on outlandihly skilled opponenets. KP and Nate are taking the long term approach in letting the team grow into themselves. They just have different roles on making that happen. But Dwight Jaynes is trying to dig up friction in his anaylsis of comments where none exists. The real story is in how our players are growing defensively (as noted by the majority of the comments to the article).
Who is throwing whom under the bus, Jaynes? I read through the article, and Nate didn’t single anyone out as the pariah on defense, and went out of his way to avoid doing just that.
As to the whole Nate & KP “schism” (please note that I love Pritchard and I believe we would not be the team we are today without him):
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
I never really liked your stuff in the Trib, I always thought you were way too much of a City of Portland hater. Now that you’ve moved to your blog, I had thought you were mellowing out, and I was even starting to enjoy your work.
Then came this. This is the same sensationalist crud I stopped reading you for. “throwing players under the bus”? A “schism” with KP?
Whatever Dwight.
And just one more time:
KP does not run this team. KP is not God.
Dwight your hate for Nate is well-known. Nice to see that even when you’re washed up, you’re still obsessed. Just stop it.
*giggle* *hack* *chuckle*
NEWS FLASH!!!! if our defense was so terrible shouldn’t our record be reflecting that? Have we not won more games than we’ve lost? Have we not held 50% of the teams we’ve played below their scoring averages?
I see two things when I watch Portland play…
1. they play down to their competition.
2. the often rise above their competition after playing down to their level.
I’ll stick with the “THIS IS A YOUNG TEAM” arguement until we are not “A YOUNG TEAM”
(I’d love for THE best defensive highschool team to actually play the worst NBA team, and of course scream “SEE! I told you so” after the worst N.B.A team SHREDED the BEST highschool team, zero doubt in my mind that that’s what would happen if that did happen.
why would it happen?…uh, becuase the highschool team was YOUNG and lacked EXPERIENCE!!!
nate did not say anything that wasn’t true…and neither did kp.
I can tell my 10 year old daughter repeatedly to put her shoes in her closet…..BUT becuase of her age….things get lost in translation quite often.
This team is still young, and can and will get better….
just you wait doubters of PORTLANDs defensive capabilities….just you wait….NEVER BE STELLAR…but it will get better with age….just like wine
I think the best example for how team defense is more than the sum of the individual defenders, is the Milwaukee Bucks. Last season they were an awful defensive team; this season – with essentially the same players – they’re much better. The difference is Scott Skiles. To a lesser extent, the same is true for Denver, except that there the change is due to the arrival of Billups, rather than a new coach. In both cases, the same players are playing much better defense (clearly Billups’s individual defense doesn’t explain the overall improvement.)
Portland has some players who are – or have the potential to be – individually decent-to-good defenders: Joel (obviously), Oden, Rudy, Bayless, LA, Batum, Rudy, Blake, and arguably Outlaw. It’s reasonable to expect the team to be at least average defensively. Clearly, they’re not.
Some of it is ostensibly the players’ fault: Roy and Outlaw are too often caught sleeping; Blake and Sergio have a hard time keeping their guys in front; Oden tends to lower his arms instead of jumping, etc. etc. etc. In fact, each of them has shown the ability to play good-to-stellar individual defense – for stretches.
Even that, mind you, is at least partly the coach’s fault: if Brandon is sleeping on defense, someone needs to kick his butt. If Outlaw keeps getting caught too far away from a shooter, he needs to be yanked – or whatever. Note that Outlaw has been playing for Nate most of his career; if Nate is such a great defensive coach, how come he’s still such a bad defender?
But good defensive coaches find ways to compensate for individual faults with smart schemes and team work. They also adjust to different situations: if the other team is repeatedly exploiting a hole, you look for ways to plug it.
Conversely, bad defensive teams find ways of making good defenders look bad. The prime example is repeatedly leaving Joel and Oden checking a PG out in space. Other times, a player might foolishly gamble on defense, leaving someone else try to clean up. These are all issues that good coaching can help with.
Finally, regarding the “youth” argument, I have two things to say to that. First, it’s not so accurate: Brandon Roy has been in this league for 2 1/2 seasons, and played 4 years in college; Outlaw, Blake, and Przybilla are all in the prime of their careers; Rudy has been playing professionally for 6 or 7 years; Sergio for 5 or 6.
Also, how many times have we heard coaches complaining that a player is already “too old” or “too set in his ways” to change his bad D habits? These guys are all good, young, unselfish, coachable, and eager to learn. They’re all reasonably talented, as well. I’ve always been told that if the students are willing to learn, it’s usually the teacher’s fault if they fail to (and as a mediocre teacher myself, I know that it’s mostly true.) One of the reasons Nate was brought to Portland in the first place, remember, was to be a teacher for a young team. Well?
Canzanoesque. That’s what this is.
Conjuring something out of nothing.
Jim:
Conjuring something out of nothing? Are you kidding? Do you watch the games? Are YOU happy with the defense and effort that you see every night? Take of the rose colored sunglasses and try paying attention when the Blazers don’t have the ball. Their defense is pathetic, as is Nate throwing his team under the bus for his coaching short comings. I’ve never said the before, but I think it’s time we start thinking about a new coach. Nate was a good choice to restore order to the franchase…and to mold this young group into a respectable team….but he will NOT get us over the hump.
If we don’t have the personel to play great defense…the we for sure have the personel to push the ball up and down the court, and score more points. To be a poor defensive team, while still taking the air out of the ball…just makes no sense. Remember the Phoenix game? We have the horses to run with anyone…why not let them free?
No one in this league is better at developing young talent than Nate.
Rashard Lewis got a huge contract after developing under Nate. Luke Ridenour was a good young PG under Nate, and hasn’t been good since Nate left.
Defense will come. All it takes is practice, commitment, and experience. If you think another coach can start 2+ rookies and win like the Blazers are winning, you’re kidding yourself. Flip Saunders? No. Van Gundy? No. The better defensive teams in the league are loaded with vets. Give the kids a chance.
Is Nate throwing his team under the bus or simply trying to light a fire under them? If it’s the former, they’d quit playing hard, I don’t see quit in this team based on the NO, Dallas, and NY games. This team believes it can come back and win games, even on the road. That’s more important to me.
GS lays out a very cogent argument. Nate is a good coach in some ways, but his calling card, defense, may not be as good as advertised. Maybe the solution is to bring in a more clever defensive specialist/coaching assistant. With that said, if the trend of bad defense continues next year, Nate will definitely feel the heat.
I just can’t figure it out. If we were like #10 in defense instead of #21 is it fair to say we’d have the best record in the league? With 4 rookies being a major part of our rotation. Come back to earth people. This team is doing much better then expected. I have never seen such an over achieving team (based on pre-season expectations) get so much criticism heaped on it.