Subscribe Feed (RSS)The city of Beaverton is near a “non-binding agreement” (which, when you think about it, is no agreement at all) to build the Beavers a ballpark. And bottom line, it’s going to cost taxpayers in that community an average of $64 a year.
At the risk of sounding insensitive, that’s not much. Seriously, if your property tax bill went up $64, would you even notice? I seriously doubt it. It’s about what you’d spend to take your family to a movie and grab a pizza afterward.
All I can say, though, is they better build a good one. A beauty. A real destination. If they do that, it’s a lock it will be successful.
The benefits from a ballpark in Beaverton will be many — economic, quality of life and just plain fun. That and the fact that a whole lot of Portlanders who really have no reason to go there these days will now be making the trek. And Beaverton will become known for something besides Nike. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
It will go down like it always does — with people complaining and moaning about the cost but then as soon as it’s open and they see the benefit, they’ll shut up, just as they have everywhere else where quality ballparks have been built.
Meanwhile, once that ballpark is open and prospering, the city of Portland can sit here amazed at how good it all looks. It’s probably what it’s going to take to get Portlanders to understand the value of these things.
It is going to be an interesting meeting today when all the few negative Beaverton resident nay sayers protest the meeting. Will the Biggi family protest now, since Beaverton is no longer interested in their property or will they now join the rest of us who want the ballpark that will draw many Portland residents into Beaverton?
As you note, Dwight, non-binding agreements are easy to get behind — a symbolic vote. Expect much bluster, but passage.
As to a general tax… I’m not pleased. Deal is heavily skewed to the public side (60%). Would much prefer ballpark related taxes, but based upon the requests from the Beavers, that seems unlikely (will not reach revenue threshold to pay the bonds).
Dwight, you know I’ve been a big supporter of professional baseball in the region, but I think general taxes for stadium construction is unfair.
– Maury
Being a resident, I am looking forward to this new step forward. I agree with you Dwight, there will be moaning until after the opening day, when it will all be washed away with joy and excitement of what is now in their backyard!
@Godzilla – I dont see the Biggi family protesting. They stand to gain from this now that their land is not in consideration. They can now develop that land with a much higher upside of value with a brand new ballpark and thousands of people visiting the vicinity. I feel as though they really won in this whole deal.
The NIMBY freakout that’s about to happen is going to be interesting to watch happen in someone else’s city. The anti-tax anti-everything people are a real treat.
Actually, Maury… I’m not against taxes for ballparks, any more than I’m against taxes for libraries, parks or performing arts centers. The reality is, if you want to play, you have to pay the entry fee. And if you want a team, you build a ballpark. I think Paulson is paying a much higher percentage of the deal than most minor-league owners pay.
Well, Dwight, we can certainly agree to a certain level. As to whether taxes for libraries, parks, zoo, performing arts centers, etc… Those, of course, are publicly owned. Beavers will profit, if the ballpark is done correctly. That’s the difference.
The key will be in the details (something always missing from non-binding deals). What will be key is how Beaverton benefits from direct use of the ballpark — the # of times the facility can be used. Other aspects that should be included would involve who picks up the tab for capital improvements — ownership should deal with that if they are to benefit from being the key tenant.
In other words, if you do a general tax, make sure it stops with just the construction of the ballpark and that the municipality paying the lion’s share of the costs benefit from using it.
Let’s be clear … just because 60 percent of the costs will be paid by taxes, that doesn’t mean Paulson will pay the other 40 percent. Sure, he’ll pay some rent, but ticket taxes and naming-rights fees are only funneled through Paulson, not being paid by him.
Every dime of ticket revenue that goes to the city, doesn’t go to Paulson’s pocket. Perhaps he could raise ticket prices to cover the difference so his net is the same, but I doubt it.
Maury… you know better than most that it’s getting increasingly difficult to make real money off ANY pro sports franchise these days. Will Merritt make money off the team there? I would think so. Enough to quickly retire that debt he’s going to take on? Not so sure about that. More power to him. He’s the one taking the big gamble. The city of Beaverton? It’s chump change for them. I think it’s funny that this is being sold to the people as “multi-purpose” — which means artificial turf, which stinks. It’s a ballpark, folks. It’s worth it as a ballpark — you don’t need picnics and concerts to justify the thing. But that’s what they have to do to get people to buy in.
Agreed, Dwight. As to the turf…
You don’t nickel and dime (value engineer) ballpark design on cornerstone aspects, and turf is one of them. Terrible idea using artificial turf. It’s primarily a baseball facility, make it look and feel like one. It will never be viewed as a gem, regardless of architectural design, if it has anything other than natural turf.
Dwight and Maury (and everybody else), I remember as recently as 2003-04 that our KJR host Mike Gastineau said that minor league baseball and arena league football were big moneymakers. We all know how much the economy can go South, and how the AFL went into the tank. Has minor league baseball gone in a similar direction? Of course, I expect the “moneymaking” to be mostly “on paper” (with the team’s net worth) as opposed to immediate cash into the owners’ pockets. Incidentally, whenever I hear “multi-purpose,” I think about what Clay Bennett said that he wanted us to build him here in Seattle!
Dwight,
You write, “as soon as it’s open and they see the benefit, they’ll shut up, just as they have everywhere else where quality ballparks have been built.”
Really?
From a Memphis Flyer piece called,”Winning on Empty: The Redbirds Take the Crown”: The Redbirds averaged 4,943 tickets sold for their three playoff games this month at AutoZone Park. Prep football on Friday, the 11th, and rainy conditions for the first two games of the Pacific Coast League Championship Series certainly limited the walk-up traffic. But regardless of the mitigating factors, to sell less than 5,000 tickets for championship baseball in the ballpark voted the best in the minor leagues is pitiful. The few hundred who actually attended — it was less than 1,000 for the two championship-series games — saw crisp, terrific baseball, each game won by the Redbirds by a single run.”
Bill — whoever wrote that piece is hopelessly naive about minor-league baseball. Post-season playoffs NEVER draw in the minors. I was in Salem for the Volcanoes winning the NWL this season — best game I saw all summer — and they drew fewer than a thousand fans. Fact is, minor-league tickets are sold as part of ticket packages, season tickets, ticket books or special promotions… playoff games are not scheduled ahead of time and are unsold, totally — season tickets are usually not valid. You start from scratch with just a few days to sell tickets. On top of that, weather is usually getting lousy and the reality is, people really don’t care all that much about minor-league playoff games.
I’m serious here — I’m shocked they sold as many tickets as they did.
I just went on-line to check out the AutoZone Park in Memphis. http://www.ballparkreviews.com/memphis/memphis.htm
This is an amazing ball park. They built it like a major league park without the 3rd deck. The irony of this link/report is the first comment made in the review was in reference to its downtown location making it one of the best new ball parks. I can only dream about watching the Beavers with my two boys in a park like this located on the MC site. Wake up Portland, we are missing the boat here! Beaverton? Multi-purpose? Field turf? To quote you Dwight: “Come on!”
I live in Beaverton and if it’s really $64/year increase I can live with that, let’s build the thing.
Turf sucks, but this is the NW and grass restricts the uses for the park. I don’t care, I don’t have to play on it.
As for Memphis, how is that relevant? Memphis has pro football, basketball, major college in town. Portland has the TrailGangstas. I have only gone to a handful of PDX Beaver games because of the hassle of going downtown. I think a Beaverton location will draw just fine, all of us suburbanites that don’t want to go downtown to be hit up a thousand times for our change or have nowhere to park will give it a try.
TrailGangstas?
That’s so 2004.
I’m just responding to Dwight’s blanket statement about minor league baseball. He wrote that as soon as the stadium opens and people see the benefit they shut up.
It doesn’t sound like this guy in Memphis got the memo. It’s also relevant because Memphis has one of the best minor league parks out there, and we’ve been told a nice park is essential for success.
I’m not opposed to minor league baseball. Anything to help the economy, but let’s not sell it with a shovel.
As a Beaverton resident, a few things to note:
1) It appears from the o-live article that the stadium will be publicly owned–i.e. Beaverton will be collecting rent and a ticket tax from the Beavers. The expected revenue from this is about $1 million per year… probably not enough to pay for capital costs, but enough to make it reasonable.
2) The lack of a location is a big issue. I get the distinct impression, though, that the Biggis would be willing to sell for the right price–but that price hasn’t been offered. The City of Beaverton, for its part, seems fully prepared to look elsewhere should a deal not be reached. There are lots of parcels along the MAX line of reasonable size–the “Tek Woods” property just west of the Tek campus (and south of Nike) is an obvious candidate.
That’s what I was thinking. On the Tek Wood location. I think that would be perfect. But Beaverton people may not like the idea of the woods being cleared out for the stadium.
Building a ball park like the Auto zone ballpark would be real nice in Beaverton. There is plenty land along the light rail, but it could be wildlife protected. Would be great if Nike could offer some sponsorship to help out.
I’m your Seattle area hard-core Blazers fan (who went to the same high school as Brandon Roy, but similarities end there). Let me just vote “yes” on your behalf in your fine city, because I’ve even told Dwight how great the atmosphere is outside in Portland, in July-August. With a new arena in Beaverton, and if as Godzilla suggested, Nike can be a sponsor and held spruce up this Beaverton arena, you mayo have a mini-Safeco! And, it would be inexpensive entertainment. Help me out here: starting from SRO, how much do minor league tickets run for?
It would give Beaverton it’s own identiy. And different from all the other suburban towns. I like it to Orange County and the Anaheim Angels. Orange County has it’s own identiy with it’s ball clubs. Beaverton would be similar in that manner.
I’m with you on the OC reference. I’m sure that you’ve been to Newport Beach, and know exactly what we’re referring to; a place of its own, with most of what you need, right there. I’ve always wondered if Beaverton is equivalent to our suburb Bellevue; a little more upscale. Maybe Tigard or Terwilliger gets that honor.
Those wishing for a Memphis-style ballpark around here should be careful what they wish for. The cost of paying for the ballpark is driving the franchise broke.
A full report on this was in Baseball America magazine in April. “The Redbirds have seen annual attendance dip 36 percent from their 2001 high. Already struggling to meet a $5 million annual bond payment, the not-for-profit ballclub faces even more economic uncertainty heading into a recession, as season-ticket renewals are off roughly 25 percent from last year.”
Autozone Park cost $80 million dollars to build and holds roughly 14,500 people. Beaverton’s ball park would hold roughly 8,600 and will cost about half that. Hopefully it will be as nice but smaller in scale.
Aside from the obvious $46 a month, what dab is there in this deal, to add to your property taxes? The doog far outweighs any dab.
It is a flat $64/year tacked on to your property tax as a bond.
Is it flat? I thought that it–like most property tax levies–was proportional to your assessed value, with the bill for the average homeowner coming to $64.
Personally, I’d rather spend that money on better schools. My actual impression of this would have to wait until I see more details–but this is something that can benefit the public on those nights the Beavs ain’t playing, it might make sense.
Oh, and as I’ve said before–Tualatin Hills Park and Rec, not the City of Beaverton, should be running the thing, even if the City owns it. THPRD already runs several excellent sports venues here in town, albeit ones geared towards amateur and public use, not professional sports.
Engineer Scotty:
1. Putting this money towards our schools would net us what? 2008-09 Beaverton schools’ base per-student expenditure was $8,400 (the general-fund operating budget of $315.6 million divided by student enrollment of 37,552). Beaverton School Dist. estimated that they spend between $9.1 million and $15.2 million per year educating and feeding all the district’s illegal-immigrant students. Throwing more money at a problem doesn’t fix the problem. You need to actually fix the problem!
2. THPRD does a great job maintaining ball field, but how much maintenance will need to be done with synthetic turf? Kind of a non issue.
“A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury’
‘From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship’”
-Alexander Tyler, 1787.
Have you seen the 450 million dollar ballpark the Minnesota Twins will play in next spring? WOW
Anyways, I think the baseball folks in the metro want to keep the beavers around and Beaverton makes sense on alot of levels. They never had a real ballpark field at PGE and I sense having this new one built will only enhance that ballpark feel that this area has long since been missing
It will be a hit and they will come. That is if Beaverton has the balls to build it
If taxes are going up $64.00, could the city at least include a free set of tickets with my property tax statement?
LOL
Exactly
Dwight,
Where is PSU going to play football games?
PSU will still play its football games at PGE Park or whatever name change the park takes after its remodel. The turf will also change to a taller turf for soccer.
How spruced up will PGE Park likely be? I remember going there with my parents for a soccer match (the team with Mia Hamm and Brandi Chastain back in 1999), so I’m not in tune with the renovation plans.
Haven’t seen any artist renderings on how it will look but I know there will be seating on the east side and more rest rooms. It will be more of a horseshoe configuration.
I’m not at all against the Beavers moving to Beaverton. In fact, it demonstrates that Beaverton has more vision than Portland, which can’t even fill the potholes in its streets.
Additionally, I’m not against public money being used to help pay for the ballpark.
However, I am opposed to the taxation method: property taxes. Facilities such as parks, schools, police stations, firehouses, and, yes, stadiums, are public assets that for the benefit of all citizens and visitors. Therefore, I object to homeowners being forced to shoulder the entire cost of building these public facilities. Renters, as well as out-of-town visitors, use these facilities. However, they don’t pay nearly as much toward the construction costs than homeowners, whose houses are assessed at the market value. (Apartments are assessed and taxed differently than homes.)
I suggest that the City of Beaverton find a way to spread out the cost of the ballpark among all citizens within its limits, as well as those who will come from out-of-town to watch games at the new ballpark. A city-wide sales tax, along with a ticket tax, would spread out the cost of building a public asset asset that benefits everyone, not just homeowners.
Anyone at the city council meeting? I heard the protesters were vocal again and vowed to get +2000 signatures to force city to put it to a vote by blocking the bond process. I bet ex-mayor Drake is laughing at all this….
I read the other day that the PGE Park design is going to add 5,000 to 6,000 seats on the east side of the stadium and 10 rows of seats on the South end under the MAC. They are going to put a screen up to cover the upper north end seats which are now covered by tarps. This is where they where suppose to put a sports bar or suites in the initial concept drawings. A metal screen? Are you kidding me? So if these details are correct they will be adding ZERO capacity to the PGE Park (17,000 est). Portland is loosing the Beavers for 5,000 – 6,000 fixed seats on the east side of the stadium? Why couldn’t they just tunnel into the east end wall and install pull-out seats so they can accommodate baseball and soccer. I have to believe someone could design this so it was concealed nicely during baseball. Portland is a joke!
They are also going to lose both dugouts in this remodel as well and you are correct, the capacity of PGE Park will not gain seating capacity as they eliminate the upper north bowl seats or the general admission seats at the north end.
Also, the PGE Park naming rights expire next year, so it may not have the PGE Park name after 2010.
Oh, Dwight. Where to start?
The benefits to Beaverton will be many? Oh really? And on the strength of that assertion, let’s go ahead and take $60 million of other people’s money and hand it over to a billionairre’s kid so he can have his playground.
That is the whole problem with this idea – all it has been from the start is a bunch of dreamy assertions about how great it will be for Beaverton. Funny, they said the same thing about the Beaverton Round.
Bottom line, the stadium’s cost will be at least FIVE TIMES what Paulson has agreed to pay for in terms of annual rent. That is, his $500K in rent would carry a $12 million facility. So taxpayers would be handing him an 80% subsidy.
Great deal? YEAH – for Paulson.
He is playing Beaverton (and you) for a chump.
Don’t be a chump, Dwight.
yea jparker… Paulson is going to make millions off this… sure he is… damn, the ballpark belongs to the city, not paulson… it will still be there years after he’s dead, for kids and families to enjoy… damn, why build libraries for all those idiot readers, too? why build parks for those stupid kids to play in? Your quality of life is perfect if you just stay in the house with the blinds closed and watch TV!
The simple fact is that if this does end up going forward it will be forced to a public vote and will be defeated. The only people it would benefit are baseball fans and no one else. That is a very small percentage of the people who wold be forced to fund it. The average homeowner would end up paying $3000 or more for the “privilege” of having to put up with even worse traffic on game nights on the already extremely overcrowded streets. Oh yay!!!
Paulson and the city can take this stadium and stick it where the sun don’t shine. Maybe they could also find room for THP&R while they are at it. Home owners are already forced to pay massive money to educate all the baby makers’ rug rats and now they want them to buy a $60000 stadium so the city can have an “identity” and an extremely small slice of the population can go watch minor league baseball? Ridiculous….
Baseball is on the way out, soccer is in. Baseball will never go over in Beaverton. Forget it. You are wasting time. Try to find somthing worthwhile to do !